Reader Series pt. 9: Discussing Victimhood with Jordan Peterson
A reader weighs in on my podcast with Dr. Jordan B. Peterson.
The following essay is by Rebekah Myrol — a third year psychology student at The University of Fraser Valley (my school).
Rebekah runs a highly informative Instagram page featuring posts on healing, trauma, breathwork, and all else psychology-related.
I encourage you to follow her to brighten your IG feed:
In this long-form piece, Rebekah reflects on my dialogue with Jordan Peterson on victimhood. She offers some powerful insights that prompted me (and hopefully you too) into some serious self-reflection. Refusing to become a victim to one’s environment is often a Sisyphean task, but it isn’t impossible as Rebekah outlines.
Enjoy.
Written by: Rebekah Myrol
Dr. Jordan Peterson is perhaps one of the most brilliant, misunderstood individuals in modern times. I’ve been inspired by his journey since he made his rise in 2016. I came from a broken family and felt directionless for a long time. My passion for psychology grew as a consequence of listening to his Maps of Meaning lectures, and his biblical series. Dr. Peterson has helped inspire me to chase my intellectual goals, while also reminding me that I have a moral responsibility to do so. Dr. Peterson's podcast and YouTube videos have acted as a guide for me for many years, and I know many others feel the same way. Rav Arora is a young Canadian essayist who I had the privilege of connecting with. I became an admirer of Rav’s work when I discovered his Substack account where he brings nuanced perspectives on violent crime, psychedelic therapy, and vaccine mandates.
Back in March 2021, Rav Arora and Dr. Jordan Peterson sat down to discuss a wide variety of problems facing Western culture today. The two examine problems with ideology, atheism, the church, systemic racism, victimhood, the death of religion, psychedelics, meaning, religious practice, and personal responsibility. The feedback from listeners and viewers was overwhelmingly positive. Individuals in the comments section shared how Dr. Peterson has saved their lives and their friends’. Mr. Arora was described as very professional, and others commented that he is a young superstar. What captivated my attention from the conversation was hearing Dr. Peterson and Rav Aroa’s perspective on victimhood and personal responsibility. There is a lot we can take away from this thought-provoking conversation, which I will cover but I recommend you listen to the full interview on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts or watch it on YouTube.
Rav poses a compelling question to Dr. Peterson regarding victimhood:
Why is victimhood culture so attractive, and why are so many people identifying as victims?
Currently we are looking back at our history with a critical eye. There are plenty of evildoers, and bad actors to discuss. Many of the abuses committed throughout history have generational effects. How do we make sure our society is fair to those whose ancestors were mistreated while also making sure that we don’t incentivize people to look for opportunities to claim victimhood? An example of this may be Carrie Bourassa, who claimed she was an Indigenous person in Canada, and now that claim is in question. It is a very nuanced question Rav asked, that some may view as unpopular but one that our society may need to reckon with.
Jordan replies,
The first part of it is people don’t necessarily regard themselves as victims. The activist types tend to regard themselves as spokespeople for the victims.
His response got me thinking of the famous quote “The road to hell is paved with good intentions”. Although the exact origin of this proverb is unclear and several variations exist, a common meaning of the phrase is that a good intention is useless unless followed through with genuine action. This is a bitter pill to swallow, but a point we must contend with. In Canada, individuals like Sir John A. MacDonald claimed they wanted to help Indigenous people assimilate, claiming it was for their benefit. However, there is no evidence that their so-called good intentions led to anything positive. Another example is Vladmir Putin, who believes that he is doing right by his people by trying to restore the former Soviet Union, however, this has only brought destruction and devastation to the citizens of Ukraine. This is all to say, your good intentions can be corrupted. We all have flaws; we are all imperfect and so too are our intentions at times.
Another example is the Black Lives Matter (BLM) movement. This movement was largely influenced by social media after George Floyd was killed by a police officer. I began to see my friends who had never openly expressed their support for the black community suddenly post a black square on their feed with a hashtag that read, #BlackLivesMatter. If I were to put myself in the shoes of individuals posting the black square, I would say that I was trying to show my support for George Floyd and the black community. I would argue that it raises awareness of the issue, it demonstrates solidarity, it starts the conversation, and it condemns what happened. All of that could be true and perhaps there is a place for it but there must also be clear, concrete, next steps forward. Currently, we live in a time where individuals post images of black boxes, the Ukrainian flag, pink shirts, and orange shirts. Individuals can think, “I’m a good person, I posted a black box, rainbow colours, or wore an orange shirt”.
While this is a great first step, there is far more work to be done.
Read: Rav Arora on BLM misinformation in The New York Post
Dr. Jordan Peterson dedicated his life to understanding what led people to countries pointing nuclear weapons at each other during the Cold War. Through this, he realized his passion was more suited to psychology than politics. He has a deep knowledge of the top psychologists throughout history, the problems ideologies create, and the Judeo-Christian ethic that our Western civilization is based upon. Addressing problems like war and racism require more from us than just a simple social media post. Dr. Peterson and Rav analyze the role religions and religious practices play in our thinking and understanding of current events and social problems.
Continuing with this, Jordan explains to Rav that the attractiveness of victimhood is largely influenced by moral behaviour. Calling yourself a victim is compelling because it makes us feel moral and that we are acting out of necessity. The antidote to victimhood mentality is taking personal responsibility for your actions. Personal responsibility can be understood as the idea that individuals instigate, choose, and determine their own actions. You and you alone are responsible for the quality of your life — and if changes need to be made, only you can make them. Our actions are what set things in motion, and we can be held morally accountable by peers or legally liable by justice system. This system is not without flaws, but it is the best one we have according to Dr. Peterson. Personal responsibility doesn’t mean your life doesn’t have its challenges. There is just no better option than taking ownership of it. You can blame your parents for getting a divorce, you can blame society for your circumstances, but it does you no benefit. It only leaves you feeling bitter and resentful.
Jordan says the following:
“The first level of attractiveness is it is a pathway to moral behaviour. It is a valid pathway, and if you don’t have a moral pathway offered to you, the compassion for the dispossessed is not a bad first approximation. But it’s not good enough. First, what makes you think you are a spokesperson for the oppressed? What makes you think that you have that right? Why should anyone take you seriously? How do you know you got the message right? Why do you think you have the solution at hand? How do you know you’re not more dangerous than the problem itself? How do you know that your dark and unexamined motivations aren’t blinding you?”
It is easy for us to define ourselves as good. We pay our taxes, say hello to the grocery clerk, and donate our change to local charities. However, we need to be intentional. We need to be aware of our values and act accordingly. We all have issues that are near and dear to our hearts that we would like to play a role in, whether it is the war in Ukraine, reconciliation, the environment, and so on. These are all noble causes, but we need to work towards being intentional and to speak up on the issues that matter to us.
Read: Rav Arora on our new era of ‘victimocracy’
What if at a young age we were taught that our traumas do not have to define us? That it is possible to have experienced terrible hardships and for victimhood to not form the core of our identity? What if we were told that it is possible to grow from trauma, to become a better person, to use the experiences we had in our lives toward working to implant hope and possibility to others who were in a similar situation? What if we all learned that it is possible to have healthy satisfaction for an in-group without projecting out-group hatred? With a clear lens and open mind, we would be able to see that not everyone in our out-group is evil, and not everyone in our in-group is perfect. At the end of the day, we are all human with the same underlying needs to be seen, to belong, to be heard, and to matter.
Rav and Dr. Peterson deliver a compelling conversation that covers a wide variety of topics and remind us just how beautifully complex and nuanced our world is. My partner and I enjoy going for long walks and listening to podcasts and interviews that host such riveting intellectual discussions. I recommend listening to the full conversation on YouTube and connecting with these brilliant thinkers on their social media platforms to follow their journey.
In her spare time, Rebekah enjoys sharing her passion for psychology. Her social media handle is The Psych Enthusiast where she creates content on how to set boundaries, jungian archetypes, music psychology, how people can improve their communication skills by using active listening techniques and so much more. She also believes in referencing the sources she is talking about. You can follow her on Instagram @thepsych.enthusiast and on Facebook @thepsychenthusiast
Rav Arora is a 20-year-old independent journalist widely published in The New York Post, The Globe and Mail, and Foreign Policy Magazine. He has appeared on The Ben Shapiro Show, Sky News Australia, The Jordan B. Peterson podcast, The Dr. Drew Show, and other programs.